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Glossary entry

French term or phrase:

des non-dits culturels

English translation:

unspoken cultural issues/factors

Added to glossary by Michael GREEN
Feb 19, 2008 10:03
16 yrs ago
5 viewers *
French term

des non-dits culturels

French to English Social Sciences Government / Politics prevention of discrimination
I am struggling to find a neat translation for this - I understand that 'non-dits' are what is left unspoken

"La discrimination est un délit, il faut certes le réprimer. Mais il est également important de faire de la prévention. Il faut aussi oser poser le problème des causes, qui sont souvent des non-dits culturels touchant à l'héritage de la colonisation et de la décolonisation, au rapport de la France avec l'islam, etc."
Proposed translations (English)
3 +5 unspoken cultural issues/factors
3 +4 cultural taboos
4 +1 longwinded
4 cultural assumptions
3 (unspoken) cultural preconceptions
3 cultural baggage
3 cultural issues that are (merely) glossed over
4 -2 forbidden cultural subjects
Change log

Mar 3, 2008 14:28: Michael GREEN Created KOG entry

Discussion

Najib Aloui Feb 19, 2008:
specifically, the issue of cultural differences. The rest of the sentence is clear enough...
Najib Aloui Feb 19, 2008:
An important remark, I think: "culturel" here is not used to mean "culturally rooted non-dits" but to refer to the class of issues that is subject to "non-dits", cultural issues...

Proposed translations

+5
45 mins
Selected

unspoken cultural issues/factors

I agree that "taboo" is too strong.
This is just another suggestion ...
Peer comment(s):
agree Anne Girardeau : D'accord pour le fond et la forme ! On ne fait pas de jugement de valeur sur ces "questions" culturelles
1 hr
Merci, Anne !
agree Gacela20
2 hrs
Merci !
agree Silvia Brandon-Pérez
3 hrs
Merci !
agree Najib Aloui
11 hrs
Thank you !
agree Ben Gaia : Yes factors is good and neutral, rather than negative, this reflects the text.
8 days
Thank you Ben - I had almost forgotten this question !
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "thank you for your help - in the end I think your solution worked best but thanks also to everyone else who contributed"
+4
1 min

cultural taboos

I think this is what they're getting at
Peer comment(s):
agree cjohnstone : a good way out to keep it short
2 mins
agree Victoria Porter-Burns : nice
4 mins
agree Jack Dunwell : V nice,yes..and,obliquely, Oz, humourous."Elephant in the room"
9 mins
disagree Ghyslaine LE NAGARD : Taboo is forbidden when "non-dit" is just what left unspoken but not because it is forbidden as indicated in the sentence: it is cultural!
18 mins
agree B D Finch : Yes, though "culturally taboo subjects" might fit the sentence better?
23 mins
disagree Bourth (X) : I too think "taboo" is going too far.
23 mins
disagree Tony M : Yes, 'taboo' completely changes the sense
41 mins
agree MMFORREST
50 mins
agree Carol Gullidge : although strictly an overstatement, I think it fits well here. It's often impossible to find an exact equivalent without lengthy explanations - which would detract more than the slight loss of meaning
53 mins
disagree Joachim Sieg (X) : I'm afraid it's more than a slight loss when you turn "non-dits" into "interdictions". The act of speaking the non-dits out would mean breaking a taboo, yes, but the non-dits themselves are not necessarily taboos, they can be all kinds of conceptions.
1 hr
agree jean-jacques alexandre
2 hrs
agree Héloïse Ki (X) : Not 'cultural taboos' perhaps, but I think you could say something like 'subjects that have become culturally taboo'. I think it's clear that the word would not be being used in the strongest sense possible, and fits with the use of 'oser'.
2 hrs
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29 mins

cultural assumptions

Maybe this gets around the "taboo" problem.
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+1
31 mins

longwinded

Can't think off-hand of a snappy expression for this, but it's all about deliberate (or subconscious) avoidance of sensitive issues that might send people on guilt trips (or before the courts).

"Avoidance of sensitive cultural issues" is all I can come up with.

Putting something of a value judgement on it, "cultural equivocation" might also work.
Peer comment(s):
agree Melissa McMahon : how about "unspoken cultural sensitivities"?
14 hrs
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45 mins

(unspoken) cultural preconceptions

I think it's arguable whether the 'unspoken' is needed or not, as I think that 'preconceptions' on its own pretty much gets across all those tacit judgements that may be made as a result of being culturally inured to certain things...
Peer comment(s):
agree Michael GREEN : Posted mine before seeing yours : I like "preconceptions" - but I think "unspoken" is needed here
4 mins
Thanks, Michael! Yes, I think you're right
neutral Anne Girardeau : pour moi preconceptions va bcp trop loin, voir http://www.wordreference.com/enfr/preconception
1 hr
preconceptions = approximativement 'idées reçues', qui corréspond assez bien à mon avis avec 'non-dits'
disagree Najib Aloui : I'll be more direct:your proposal clearly shows that despite your feverish activity, you understand nothing to the notion you're trying to translate here.
10 hrs
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4 hrs

cultural baggage

This may be too colloquial for your text, but another suggestion which hints at the unspoken side of things.

Best,
Jocelyne
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6 hrs

cultural issues that are (merely) glossed over

or something along these lines, i.e. (deliberately) omitted without actually being 'no go areas' !
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-2
11 hrs

forbidden cultural subjects

...simple, natural and common ...

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Note added at 13 hrs (2008-02-19 23:06:29 GMT)
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Explanation about "forbidden" here: not in the sense of an outside and clear rule but in the sense of a diffuse but still very strong reluctance or avoidance to talk about an issue that is felt as disturbing...I haven't invented this meaning in English , it's very largely used...Kinjite -

Forbidden Subjects (1989)- [ Traduire cette page ]Kinjite - Forbidden Subjects: Businessman Hiroshi Hada's teenage daughter has been kidnapped and enslaved by a prostitution ring. And Lt. Crowe, a.
movies.go.com/kinjite-forbidden-subjects/d819744/action - 31k
Forbidden subject: Suicide among SAPS officials - Nedbank ISS ...- [ Traduire cette page ]

Forbidden subject: Suicide among SAPS officials ... crime and corruption among police officials and the police culture which often denies the problem and ...
www.iss.co.za/Pubs/CRIMEINDEX/00VOL4NO5/forbidden.html - 16k
Trade Research - World Bank Focused On Fighting Corruption- [Not too long ago, corruption was perceived either as a phenomenon that was inevitable, or a forbidden subject. There was a certain fatality in the belief ...
go.worldbank.org/XVF4U1C3U0 - 74k
Peer comment(s):
disagree Tony M : Yes, but these are not 'forbidden' like taboos, but simply things that are unsaid
17 mins
I think you know exactly the meaning of "forbidden" here, it's not the one that deserves a "disagree", I'll explain nevertheless, see above...
disagree Ben Gaia : Not good English. Sounds unnatural. ...Salaam aleikum sadiiqi! I would say, as a native speaker and teacher of English and an MA, that the answer is "yes". Na'am. That is why this forum exists, so that others may improve their translations.
7 days
The formal rules of English allow it, public usage admits it...Oua aleikoum essalam ya saddikki and thank you for your help! Is it the formula " forbidden subject" that you consider as unnatural and bad?
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