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réfrigérateur tout-utile
le « détestable ceci »
Jul 12, 2009 10:29
14 yrs ago
2 viewers *
French term

récolter

French to English Art/Literary Art, Arts & Crafts, Painting fixed expression?
Hello all.

The following sentence is from a text about modern art and its links to art history. It is the beginning of a new section.

Notre siècle récoltera-t-il la manne, cette menue monnaie de rupture à laquelle je pense avoir dit que je ne croyais guère ?

The text then goes on to give a quote from the artist saying that his painting just "is", which the writer then contextualizes with further quotes from philosophers, other artists and so forth. I guess the idea is to say that art always exists in relation to a cultural context despite twentieth-century philosophizing about rupture, breaks and the like.

My question: does "récolter la manne" simply mean gather manna (from heaven), find food in the wilderness, or does it have a different meaning as an expression (something which might relate more clearly to "small change")? I think it is the mixed metaphor that is worrying me.

This particular text is quite enigmatic, and seems to need "teasing out" to make sense - but I'd hate to extrapolate in the wrong direction!

All help gratefully received, as ever.
Proposed translations (English)
3 gain/benefit from the windfall
3 +3 Harvest the manna
3 +1 will it reap / or win the manna ?
4 gather hay while the sun shines

Discussion

mr mckeen Jul 14, 2009:
Manna Manna to me means power, or in a surfing context, 'stoke' from the polynesian word for inner spirit. Don't know if that helps but something like 'to bring out spirit' or 'grant us power/empower us' could fit I think...
David Vaughn Jul 12, 2009:
manna merriam-webster's: manna - "a usually sudden and unexpected source of gratification, pleasure or gain"
David Vaughn Jul 12, 2009:
Manna Manna from heaven, a common English phrase, is basically the equivalent of "magic". It's simply an expression with no particular religious overtones necessary. An unjustified benefit. A magical reward. This seems to follow a rather common anti-modernist discourse that is quite common in recent years, from Prince Charles to numerous French art criticism books. Just another artist raving, justifiably or not, against institutionalized post-modernism.
Susan Nicholls (asker) Jul 12, 2009:
Hi everyone I don't know why, I've only just received all these comments at once in my in-box. Thought you were all out to Sunday lunch...
Yes, well: it is an art critic/writer going to town writing a text for an artist friend for an upcoming exhibition. Obtuse is the right word for it, Helen: it is a kind of poetic evocation of cultural history with a lot left unsaid. As I see it, what is meant is the following: if there were such a thing in history as moments of rupture, or radical rupture, then art would be left in the wilderness gathering manna from heaven; this would be "small change" compared to what had been lost. But as I said, the mixed metaphor rather confuses the issue, assuming I have read it right. Maybe the question is: what kind of return can art expect from a philosophy of rupture? Small change. The text is not a sustained criticism, more a sort of intellectual/poetical evocation of a whole host of issues to do with heritage and tradition.
Have I explained this clearly enough?
Helen Shiner Jul 12, 2009:
I presume the sense is that will our century experience some form of rupture in the form of 'divine intervention' of the sort that manna represented? A bit obtuse. The writer indicating that he/she does not believe in such things, ie we need to proceed on the basis of what is or is likely to be, not in expectation of a miracle.
Helen Shiner Jul 12, 2009:
Hi Susan is there any conceivable spiritual or religious sense in the text at this point? If not, surely we have to move away from manna. We do speak of something being 'manna from heaven', but that doesn't seem to be what is meant here, does it?
nordiste Jul 12, 2009:
"récolter la manne" n'a pas à ma connaissance d'autre sens que le sens littéral, même si l'origine biblique est un peu oubliée tant l'expression est devenue courante. On parle aussi parfois de "manne tombée du ciel" pour un profit ou un bénéfice inespéré.
Helen Shiner Jul 12, 2009:
Hi Susan This is not an expression I have seen used in such a context, but I wonder if you could get around the apparent mixed metaphor by saying 'reaped the reward' or 'reaped the benefit'? I have not posted this as an answer because without having a sense of what precedes this sentence, it is rather difficult from what you have given so far to get a sense of just what the author might mean here. This is presumably a Marxian critique of later approaches to art history based on Foucault and the like. We all operate within the prevailing discourses, in other words, even when we try to subvert them.

Proposed translations

4 hrs
Selected

gain/benefit from the windfall

the slight spin-off effects...
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "I opted for "windfall" in the end actually following your analysis Vaughn (although I know you preferred manna) that it is something that appeared magically, out of the blue - but the main reason is that it was such a complex text, this made more immediate sense in the context for the reader. Actually the two meanings (unexpected return on investment vs. magic appearance of what is needed) are possibly two sides of the same coin. Thank you all for your comments and answers."
+1
12 mins

will it reap / or win the manna ?

could be a viable option
Peer comment(s):
neutral Helen Shiner : This really is unlikely to work, I'm afraid, unless there is a direct Biblical link.
27 mins
agree David Vaughn : Yes, I rather prefer "reap" here. Manna and manne are very much the same level of language, I'd even say that manna from heaven is much more common than any comparable French phrase, French being much less biblical than English.
2 hrs
thank you !
Something went wrong...
+3
45 mins

Harvest the manna

www.grundskyld.dk/71-food.html
Peer comment(s):
agree André Vanasse (X)
1 hr
Merci beaucoup!
agree Sylvia Valls
4 hrs
Merci beaucoup!
agree George C.
7 hrs
Merci beaucoup!
Something went wrong...
3965 days

gather hay while the sun shines

If you make hay while the sun shines, you take advantage of a good situation which is not likely to last. With house prices at an all-time high, both property developers are making hay while the sun shines. You've got to make hay while the sun shines — and it doesn't shine long in a sporting life.
Something went wrong...
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