This site uses cookies. Some of these cookies are essential to the operation of the site, while others help to improve your experience by providing insights into how the site is being used. For more information, please see the ProZ.com privacy policy.
Cookie settings
velours milplum
W-Th-C
    The asker opted for community grading. The question was closed on 2012-11-05 09:17:42 based on peer agreement (or, if there were too few peer comments, asker preference.)
Nov 2, 2012 08:38
11 yrs ago
3 viewers *
French term

Oreiller de paresse

Not for points French to English Art/Literary Psychology
Comment traduire "oreiller de paresse" en anglais ?

Le contexte est une ligne de production ou des ouvriers peuvent être tentés de minimiser leurs travaux de contrôle qualité en se déchargeant de leur responsabilité sur le service de qualité qui effectue le contrôle de la bienfacture.

Cette décharge est motivée à la fois par la paresse (Quelqu'un d'autre le fera) que par solution de facilité (De toute façon, ils sont payés pour vérifier le travail !)

Je cherche a exprimer le fait que les ouvriers ne doivent pas céder à la facilité de la paresse en laissant le travail à un autre ni à abandonner leur responsabilité sous prétexte que c'est le travail d'autres personnes.
Je ne fais pas le constat que certains agissent ainsi (le constat est connu) mais à les motiver à changer de manière de pratiquer.
Merci d'avance !
Proposed translations (English)
3 +1 (take the) easy way out, rest on one's laurels
3 +1 to pass the buck
References
Jean-Jacques Rousseau?

Discussion

R D Oliwaw (asker) Nov 4, 2012:
If I had to tell it like a fairy tale, part 3 It is not that these good workers start to be lazy, it is that they do not see any reason to continue to perform as before because the psychological reward has faded away. People develop such strategies automatically and uncousciously. It is a social mecanism which is taking place at the level of the group when the group is large enough to let such strategies emerge.

The expression I am searching is an image like "passing the buck" which makes it easier to understand to the professional and non professional audience.

And yes, may you are right, I have to give more explanation.
R D Oliwaw (asker) Nov 4, 2012:
If I had to tell it like a fairy tale, part 2 In social science, such phenomenon is known as "homeostasis", it is an application of the action-reaction phenomenon: the social systems is developing a kind of resistance to the change and spontaneously creates strategies who will weaken the change and maintain the paradigms of the social system more or less unchanged.
One must be aware it is a completely unconscious phenomenon, nobody wakes up one morning thinking "Today, I will resist to the change !". In fact, it is a finely tuned social mecanism: because of the change, the former bad workers have to increase the quality of the production or they will be fired. Simultaneously, the good workers see the bad workers invading their psychologigal field of membership of the corporation of the good people. Even if these good workers never received any reward for the quality of their production, this psychological feeling of being good was a self inflicted reward. With the increased quality of the bad workers, this reward fades and the quality of the production of these former good workers begins to decrease.
R D Oliwaw (asker) Nov 4, 2012:
If I had to tell it like a fairy tale, part 1 Once upon a time, there were production lines with good workers and bad workers. Good workers were producing good products and bad workers were producing flawed products.
One day someone said "We must change it !" and he proposed a strange idea: some people, instead of producing items, would go at the end of the production chain and control items one by one. He said "Whit this idea, the good workers continue to produce good products and the bad workers increase the quality of their products. Therefore, all products will be good !"
During the first weeks and months, it was working according to the idea: the quality of the products built by the bad workers increased. But after a longer period, a strange phenomenon appeared: the quality of the good workers decreased and joined the quality level of the former bad workers. Globally, the average quality stabilized at a level slightly higher than before but it never peaked at the expected level which was the level of the production of the former good workers.
ormiston Nov 4, 2012:
thank you RD and glad I could help
R D Oliwaw (asker) Nov 4, 2012:
The situation is an activity analysis of a production chain. Theoretically, every one is responsible of the quality of what it produces but in the reality, everyone is expecting the next one will perform this quality related check, especially people shift to the quality control at the end of the chain the task to control the product as a whole.
It is theoretically correct because this quality control was built to be performed this way but in the reality, even if this last control is efficient, the cost of the correction of a finished product is prohibitive.
Therefore, passing the buck is certainly the best suited expression.
Nikki Scott-Despaigne Nov 3, 2012:
@ Asker The situation may be described in a number of ways. In order to make useful suggestions, please could you provide context. It would be helpful to situate your expression in the original context.
Kate Collyer Nov 2, 2012:
Longwinded but potentially useful "There is a job that needs doing, and Anybody can do it, but Nobody does it, because Everybody thinks that Somebody is doing it."
Tony M Nov 2, 2012:
Context Please could you give us the actual sentence in FR in which this term appears?

Proposed translations

+1
16 hrs
Selected

(take the) easy way out, rest on one's laurels

Not a very high confidence rating for this as I'd prefer to see the original term/expression in an extract from the original text.
Never the less, from my ramblings in my reference post, I consider this may be an accurate solution for meaning of "oreiller de paresse".

Cf my reference post on Rousseau and all that. The expression may have found its way into French but, although there are a couple of indications that it may be used in English, it is probably the case for a few individuals, and a direct "pillow of laziness" is certainly not a safe solution for UK target readers.

"Le contexte est une ligne de production ou des ouvriers peuvent être tentés de minimiser leurs travaux de contrôle qualité en se déchargeant de leur responsabilité sur le service de qualité qui effectue le contrôle de la bienfacture."

I quite like Ormiston's "pass the buck" here as this is what is happening, if by ommission rather than by action. Question, me thinking out loud : can the buck be passed by ommission?


"Cette décharge est motivée à la fois par la paresse (Quelqu'un d'autre le fera) que par solution de facilité (De toute façon, ils sont payés pour vérifier le travail !)"

I think "Easy way out" is a better fit here.


"Je cherche a exprimer le fait que les ouvriers ne doivent pas céder à la facilité de la paresse en laissant le travail à un autre ni à abandonner leur responsabilité sous prétexte que c'est le travail d'autres personnes."

The workers must not take the easy way out by passing the buck????


We really need to know at what point in the original the expression referred to is used.
Peer comment(s):
agree Jocelyne Cuenin : se dit en Suisse. Si j'ai bien compris, cela implique aussi quelque chose comme ' slide into the path of least resistance'
14 hrs
Something went wrong...
+1
14 mins

to pass the buck

me vient à l'esprit

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 17 mins (2012-11-02 08:56:02 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

un petit exemple:

In short, it was a large-scale pass-the-buck operation.
europarl.europa.eu

Bref, on s'est contenté de repousser le travail à faire.

europarl.europa.eu

Note from asker:
To Nikki Scott-Despaigne: I agree with "pass the buck" because the work is always done, but with less carefulness, less commitment. The question is not to determine if the work is done or not but with which grade of perfectness (in this case: lesser quality because of a lower commitment to the task). Everyone is supposed to work accurately but, because of the characteristics of the industrial process, everyone delegates to the next one the responsibility of monitoring the quality. It is not "true" laziness, it is more opportunistic behavior: the system allows it, so why not do it ??
Peer comment(s):
neutral Nikki Scott-Despaigne : Maybe, but we're lacking the term in its original context. Also, "repousser" work means "to put off" until later, not "pass the buck". //Your answer for term seems fine, but example not spot on. Pass buck=se renvoyer la balle, se refiler la patate chaude.
5 hrs
I am not sure the word as quoted means 'till later' or that it is necessarily a good translation of 'pass the buck'
agree SafeTex : Perfect to describe the behaviour described
12 hrs
neutral Tony M : I agree with Nikki, and in the light of Asker's additional explanations, I can't help feeling this is just slightly skewed from the meaning really needed here.
2 days 12 hrs
Something went wrong...

Reference comments

16 hrs
Reference:

Jean-Jacques Rousseau?

I don't know if Rousseau actually coined the phrase, but here's a source suggesting a citation in which he appears to have used it, although no source is given, which is a little unsatisfactory. Need to do more rooting around.


http://www.citations.com/citations-du-theme-science-et-techn...


""Un autre oreiller de paresse dans toute affaire un peu longue, quoique aisée, était pour lui l'incertitude que le temps jette sur les succès qui dans l'avenir semblent les plus assurés "


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 hrs (2012-11-03 01:08:31 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

It would indeed appear to be by Rousseau in "Dialogues" : http://books.google.fr/books?id=ewowAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA275&lpg=PA...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 hrs (2012-11-03 01:20:39 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

L'Abbé Martin du Theil in "Jean-Jacques Rousseau : apologiste de la religion chrétienne" describes (p140) :
"à force de me parler de vos doutes, vous m'en donniez d'inquiétants sur votre compte ; vous me faites douter s'il y a des choses dont vous ne doutez pas : ces doutes même à mesure qu'ils croissent, vous rendent tranquille; vous vous y reposez, comme sur un oreiller de paresse".

If the reference in the original text put by the Asker does refer to Rousseau (or the Abbé Martin du Theil), then I do not see where "oreiller de paresse" fits in. The description of the situation by the Asker does indeed describe a scenario where some passing of the buck is going on. With the Rousseau element, I am not confident that the expression asked for is in fact synonymous with buck passing.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 16 hrs (2012-11-03 01:28:13 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

There are references to "pillow of lazinesss" (a direct reference to Rousseau???), but they are, (like the lands where the Jumblies live) far and few. If my Rousseau hunch is right, then I think the 40 odd Google hits suggest that using the expression "pillow of laziness" would be unwise in English. However, I think it is used to describe a situation where an individual is failing to make an effort, failing to seek a solution and where he is preferring to take no risk and remain in a comfortable position. That would tie in with the "paresse.... solution de facilité" you describe.
Peer comments on this reference comment:
agree Tony M : I think to some extent it just means (allowing oneself to be/come) 'slacking', or 'slapdash'
1 day 20 hrs
neutral ormiston : this is a neutral comment. I offered a translation of the IDEA the Asker was trying to put across, perhaps not coined by the posted term. Shirking one's duties is a sign of laziness/sloppiness but he seemed to want to give the idea of 'palming it off'
2 days 12 hrs
Something went wrong...
Close search
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search