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Glossary entry

English term or phrase:

Wielkopolska vs. Greater Poland

English answer:

Wielkopolska Region

Added to glossary by petrolhead
Oct 18, 2013 13:19
10 yrs ago
7 viewers *
English term

Wielkopolska vs. Greater Poland

English Other Geography Name of a ragion
Wielkopolska is a large geographical and also historical region in western Poland.

I am seeking advice/guidance from the native speakers of English on what name should be used for this region in the English text for a pictorial album on the history of a local museum.

A number of publications written in Poland and translated into English (often by Polish translators), Wikipedia included, have adopted the "Greater Poland" rendering which is a direct, nearly verbatim (actually "Great" would be closer) translation of "Wielkopolska". It seems a somewhat artificially coined name to me.

Does "Greater Poland" mean anything to the speakers of English?

Or should "Wielkopolska" and "the Wielkopolska Region" rather be used (with a comment here, and an explanation there) in a publication that deals specifically with Wielkopolska anyway?

Any comments would be gratefully received.
Responses
3 +3 Wielkopolska Region
3 Greater/Great Poland
Change log

Oct 23, 2013 06:06: petrolhead Created KOG entry

Discussion

petrolhead (asker) Oct 23, 2013:
Big thanks to everyone. Thank you all for your comments and contributions. Your assistance has been very helpful.
Charlesp Oct 21, 2013:
"great" would not be correct. "great" would not be correct, "greater" is what is used in other contexts --
for this I would suggest both; the translation of "Wielkopolska" along with the origional.
Tony M Oct 18, 2013:
I agree with everyone in principle! I do think it is important that soemwhere or other, at the start of your document, perhaps, you should give an explanation of the connection with the historic name 'Greater Poland' — that way, no-one is left out or forgotten. After all, there are plenty of precedents for translating place names, the practice seems to have gone out of fashion a bit these days, helped of course by places recovering their original (or newly-coined) 'native' names.
Charles Davis Oct 18, 2013:
Quite so... though I suppose this album may well reach people outside Poland; it's not necessarily just for people who are actually there. But the name of the region will clearly have been dealt with at an early stage.
Carol Gullidge Oct 18, 2013:
which brings us back to the fact that this is in a local museum, and that the readers presumably do have some idea of where they are, i.e., their current geographical location! In other words, "Wielkopolska" will already have been glossed - if indeed that is necessary.
Charles Davis Oct 18, 2013:
I think this is a tricky decision. There are arguments both ways.

“Greater Poland” is not a recent coinage by some Polish translator; it’s a long-established historical English name for the region, derived from the Latin name Polonia maior. Historians always refer to the Chronicle of Greater Poland (thirteenth century) rather than the Chronicle of Wielkopolska. So whatever its virtues (or lack of them) as a name, it is sanctioned by long use.

However, it isn’t really a very satisfactory name, since most people unfamiliar with it (which is most people) would naturally take it to mean an area larger than the current political territory of Poland, perhaps where Poland has had a historical influence or Polish is spoken or ethnic Poles live. This is particular so by analogy with greater Germany, Großdeutschland, the ideal of pan-Germanists.

Besides, by Polish standards (with great respect), “Wielkopolska” is not a particularly alarming word for English speakers. I think on balance, in this context, I would use it with an explanation at some point, probably mentioning the English name “Greater Poland”.
Carol Gullidge Oct 18, 2013:
If the publication deals specifically with Wielkopolska anyway, then presumably it has already been glossed/explained for the British-speaking audiences.
personally, I had never heard of it, but as this is in a local museum, then, presumably, the readers will know where they are!

But in any case, you could do worse than refer to the guardian style guide on the matter, although note that their list of exceptions is NOT exhaustive: http://www.theguardian.com/styleguide/f

Scroll down to "foreign placenames" (sic)

Responses

+3
33 mins
Selected

Wielkopolska Region

is what I'd use with an explanation if necessary though if it's a local museum it should be obvious.

Greater Poland TO ME personally would mean the land of Poland not just an area within it.

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Note added at 39 mins (2013-10-18 13:58:27 GMT)
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I'd follow the general rule of not translating place names unless there is a direct equivalent. Especially since this is an historical region
Greater Poland or Great Poland, often known by its Polish name
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_Poland
Wielkopolska [vjɛlkɔˈpɔlska] ( listen) (German: Großpolen; Latin: Polonia Maior) is a historical region of west-central Poland. Its chief city is Poznań.

But for sure, read the guidelines pointed out by Carol.

The Greater London region for example would refer to the city of London with its outlying suburbs i.e the entire built up area
or agglomeration with all the boroughs

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greater_London

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Note added at 53 mins (2013-10-18 14:12:23 GMT)
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Well, that might affect sEnglish speakers who know German but for me, as I said, I would not assume it was an historical name for a region at all, but the whole country of Poland. But others could disagree. As Charles says, "it's not clearcut":-)

I remember in school history learning about Frederick the Great of Prussia but years later when I met Poles for the first time and spoke to them about him they said there was no such place as Prussia! So, really, politics and history are interwoven...I think it's safer to stick to the Polish name.

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Note added at 58 mins (2013-10-18 14:18:01 GMT)
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Just read Charles' discussion entry and agree completely with him. Most people are ignorant of the history of other countries (and even of their own for that matter).

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Note added at 1 hr (2013-10-18 14:27:12 GMT)
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so, you could do, also historically known as... at the beginning.

The point I was making about "Greater" London, has been made more fully by Charles re "Greater Germany" or Pan-Germanism

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Note added at 5 days (2013-10-24 09:33:51 GMT) Post-grading
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Glad to have helped:-)
Note from asker:
Thank you! One thing to bear in mind is that the German name Großpolen is very common because the region had been under the German rule for over 100 years. Question is whether "Great Poland" means anything (a region) to English speakers or whether it might also suggest it refers Poland at a certain point in the past when it was among European powers.
Peer comment(s):
agree Charles Davis : On balance I'd use the Polish name, but it's not clearcut.
7 mins
Thanks Charles:-)
agree P.L.F. Persio : agree with Charles.
16 mins
Thanks MissDutch:-)
agree Cilian O'Tuama : history of a local museum - reader will know it has to be Polish.
3 days 9 hrs
many thanks Cilian.
Something went wrong...
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Much appreciated!! This is what I intended to use all along, so I am glad so many professionals share my view. "
24 mins

Greater/Great Poland

If the literal translation of the Polish name is 'Great Poland', then why not translate it just as we translate 'Black Forest', etc. Especially considering Polish authors have already done so, and the Encyclopedia Britannica uses 'Great Poland'.
Note from asker:
Thnak you!
Something went wrong...
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