Jan 5, 2010 16:34
14 yrs ago
Russian term

Difference between 'сознающий' and 'сознаваемый'

Russian to English Other Religion
I am translating a text about the Holy Trinity. This section is talking about the philosopher Solovyov's theory on the Trinity:

"Соловьёв утверждает, что истина триединства «вполне понятна с логической стороны»: примером такого существа, для которого триединство имело бы существенное значение, оказывается жизнь человеческого духа, в тождестве сознающего, сознаваемого и акта сознания."

I am struggling to understand the difference between сознающий and сознаваемый here. Any help would be mush appreciated.
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Non-PRO (1): Jim Tucker (X)

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Discussion

Alexandra Taggart Jan 5, 2010:
the author has put foot in a mouth? The text provided is written nicely,gives way to precision.
DTSM Jan 5, 2010:
Sonia You don't have "сознаваемый" in that piece of source text you have provided. What you have is "сознаваемого" which is a case form of "сознаваемое" (see Oleksiy's post above). And I think Maxim's comment is correct and should help you to understand the difference.
Maxim Mustafaev Jan 5, 2010:
сознающий - причастие действительного залога (Participle I form), сознаваемый - причастие страдательного залога (Participle II form)
Oleksiy Markunin Jan 5, 2010:
Как я понимаю: сознающий - тот, кто сознает что-то; а сознаваемое - то, что сознается сознающим.
Hope it makes sense)

Proposed translations

+1
4 hrs
Selected

the knower and that which is known

Or, for your whole phrase:

the identity of the knower, that which is known, and the act of knowing.


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Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-05 21:23:39 GMT)
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That's the simple option, I think. And "knowledge" has been used for "сознание" in standard translations of Solovyov. If, however, there is a sustained, logical exposition in your text, then you might want to opt for what Chernyshov proposed, "the identity of the one who is conscious, the object of consciousness, and the act of being conscious," or something like that. Because there are places where Solovyov goes into great detail about this concept/act of сознание, including taking the word apart. Sorry that this quotation is from an English translation, rather than the original, because I'd like to confirm that it is also "сознание" which has been translated here as "knowledge" at the beginning of the sentence. Anyway, maybe it will be interesting:

"And this knowledge of fact - immediately and inseparably connected with the fact itself, always found with it, beside it, and therefore justly called con-sciousness [so-znaniye], con-scientia, Bewusstsein (i.e., Bei-wusstein) - must be acknowledged as absolutely valid because here knowledge directly agrees with its object, thought is a simple repetition of fact, judgment is the expression of pure identify: A = A."
From: Основы теоретической философии, trans. by Vlada Tolley and James P. Scanlan.
Peer comment(s):

agree DTSM
10 hrs
Thanks, Dmitry.
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank you very much!"
35 mins

Perceiving vs. Perceived

That's how I read it
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36 mins

subject and object of awareness

Only this idea so far

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Note added at 38 mins (2010-01-05 17:12:42 GMT)
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It reflects the idea I've posted in Discussion
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36 mins

cognizant, cognizable

.

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Note added at 48 mins (2010-01-05 17:22:23 GMT)
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Here is a link which might be helpful to you: http://books.google.com/books?id=0kRZ52N8TJsC&pg=PA94&lpg=PA...





The whole fullness of the triune spirit: in the first place, I am the one who knows and wills. Consequently, my being as such contains in itself both knowledge and will. Second, if I know, I know or am conscious of the fact that I am and that I will. Thus, here too, in knowledge as such, or under the form of knowledge, both being and will are contained. Third and last, I will myself, yet not simply myself but myself as one who is and knows; I will my being and knowledge. … Each of these three fundamental acts of the spirit is completed in itself by the other two and thus becomes individualized, as it were, into full triune being.

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54 mins

awareness and conscious awareness

and consciousness
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54 mins

the learner/disciple, knowledge and an act of learing

можно и с такой точки зрения
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59 mins

knowing, knowable

-
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+1
1 hr

The conscious, the object of consciousness and the act of consciousness

сознающий - somebody who is conscious of his existence (in this context)

сознаваемый - something which is the object of somebody's consciousness
Peer comment(s):

agree svetlana cosquéric
2 days 3 hrs
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2 hrs

the one who understands, that which is understood, the process of understanding

Just a thought
Peer comment(s):

neutral Alexandra Taggart : The terms you use belong to psychology and here - philosophy of a religious trend.If not that - could be perfect.
3 hrs
As I understand the writer, he is trying to explain the inexplicable by means of logic. Is it the translation of the verb you object to, Alexandra? Thank you for your feedback.
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4 hrs

an equalization of it's cognizance, of the cognitive and the act of cognition.

" Soloviev states, that the Trinity union "is fully comprehensible in the sense of it's logic analysis"; an example of such an entity for which the Trinity is the matter of principle, will be a life of a human spirit , occuring in an equalization of it's cognizance (self-awareness), of the cognitive (subject of comprehension) and the act of cognition."


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Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-05 21:04:21 GMT)
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http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cognizance

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Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-05 21:07:47 GMT)
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http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cognitive

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Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-05 21:10:48 GMT)
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http://www.thefreedictionary.com/cognition

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Note added at 23 hrs (2010-01-06 16:19:42 GMT)
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I've appologised to my dear colleague already, I've made a mistake twice: ITS, no apostrophy, if only the asker will accept my correction.
Peer comment(s):

neutral Kim Metzger : it's = it is. Of it is cognizance? There's a correct way to spell 'its' and a wrong way. http://www.re-vision.com/spelling/itsits.html
16 hrs
Sorry, Kim. The apostrophy is redundant, sorry.My imagination.
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1 day 6 hrs

the unity of) knowing, the known (, and the act of cognition

Pure hermeneutics! Easier said than done!
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